Lanceu Armstrongu odvzeli vse naslove
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Tyler Hamilton: The Secret Race: Inside the Hidden World of the Tour de France: Doping, Cover-ups, and Winning at All Costs
"At the foot of Alpe d’Huez, five Posties went to the front. Heras and Chechu started sprinting—full gas, as vicious a sprint as they could manage. It was the kind of punch that had won four previous Tours, superhigh wattage for a couple of minutes. For a second, I got dropped. Then I got back on.
That’s the moment. If someone wants to see where doping affects a race, I’d point them to those ten seconds at the foot of Alpe d’Huez in 2003. When Lance and company accelerated, I was instantly twenty, thirty feet back. Without the BB*, I would have fallen further back and never returned; my day would have been over. But with the BB, I had those extra five heartbeats, those twenty more watts. With the BB, I could claw my way back. On the video, you can see me rising out of the bottom of the picture; I catch on to the lead group. And when Lance looks back, I’m right there.
Lance keeps attacking, spinning the pedals, hitting his numbers. But he can’t drop us: it’s Mayo and his teammate Haimar Zubeldia, Beloki and Vino. And no Posties—because Lance is alone now; he’s burned up his helpers.
A few minutes into the Alpe, Lance gets out of the saddle, standing like he does when he’s going his hardest. I can’t stand—my collarbone hurts too much—so I grit my teeth, keep sitting, and go as deep as I can. It was like those old training days: just him and me in the mountains above Nice. He’s giving his all, and I’m answering.
How’s that?
—I’m still here.
How’s that?
—Still here.
A little math: the leader on a climb typically spends 15 to 20 more watts than the guy in his slipstream. That’s why you want to follow as much as you can, conserving your energy for the key moments, the attacks and replies. The phrase we use is “burning matches,” meaning that each rider has a certain number of big efforts he can make. Now, on Alpe d’Huez, Lance was burning one match after another.
We sense it, and start attacking him. First Beloki, then Mayo, then I give it a dig, leaving Lance behind. And it works. For a few seconds, I’m in the clear. On the television broadcast, commentators Phil Liggett and Paul Sherwen are going crazy.
“We’ve never seen a climb like this before,” Liggett shouts. “They believe [Lance is] vulnerable! They actually believe Armstrong can be beaten!”
Lance has the bad face going: deep lines on the forehead, lower lip pushed out, head tipped forward. He drags himself up to me. Then Mayo escapes, charging up the road, his unzipped orange jersey flapping like a superhero’s cape. Vinokourov follows; Lance lets them both go. I try to escape again, but Lance follows. Now we’ve reversed roles; he’s the one telling me, I’m still here, dude.
By the last switchbacks, we’re both out of matches; we ride the last few kilometers of the climb close to each other. Mayo scores the victory; Vino is second; Lance and I finish with five others, with Ullrich only 1:24 behind. Afterward, all the talk in the media is of Lance’s weakness. But we riders know that they’ve got it wrong. The truth is that the playing field, for the first time in my Tour de France career, is level."
*blood bags
"At the foot of Alpe d’Huez, five Posties went to the front. Heras and Chechu started sprinting—full gas, as vicious a sprint as they could manage. It was the kind of punch that had won four previous Tours, superhigh wattage for a couple of minutes. For a second, I got dropped. Then I got back on.
That’s the moment. If someone wants to see where doping affects a race, I’d point them to those ten seconds at the foot of Alpe d’Huez in 2003. When Lance and company accelerated, I was instantly twenty, thirty feet back. Without the BB*, I would have fallen further back and never returned; my day would have been over. But with the BB, I had those extra five heartbeats, those twenty more watts. With the BB, I could claw my way back. On the video, you can see me rising out of the bottom of the picture; I catch on to the lead group. And when Lance looks back, I’m right there.
Lance keeps attacking, spinning the pedals, hitting his numbers. But he can’t drop us: it’s Mayo and his teammate Haimar Zubeldia, Beloki and Vino. And no Posties—because Lance is alone now; he’s burned up his helpers.
A few minutes into the Alpe, Lance gets out of the saddle, standing like he does when he’s going his hardest. I can’t stand—my collarbone hurts too much—so I grit my teeth, keep sitting, and go as deep as I can. It was like those old training days: just him and me in the mountains above Nice. He’s giving his all, and I’m answering.
How’s that?
—I’m still here.
How’s that?
—Still here.
A little math: the leader on a climb typically spends 15 to 20 more watts than the guy in his slipstream. That’s why you want to follow as much as you can, conserving your energy for the key moments, the attacks and replies. The phrase we use is “burning matches,” meaning that each rider has a certain number of big efforts he can make. Now, on Alpe d’Huez, Lance was burning one match after another.
We sense it, and start attacking him. First Beloki, then Mayo, then I give it a dig, leaving Lance behind. And it works. For a few seconds, I’m in the clear. On the television broadcast, commentators Phil Liggett and Paul Sherwen are going crazy.
“We’ve never seen a climb like this before,” Liggett shouts. “They believe [Lance is] vulnerable! They actually believe Armstrong can be beaten!”
Lance has the bad face going: deep lines on the forehead, lower lip pushed out, head tipped forward. He drags himself up to me. Then Mayo escapes, charging up the road, his unzipped orange jersey flapping like a superhero’s cape. Vinokourov follows; Lance lets them both go. I try to escape again, but Lance follows. Now we’ve reversed roles; he’s the one telling me, I’m still here, dude.
By the last switchbacks, we’re both out of matches; we ride the last few kilometers of the climb close to each other. Mayo scores the victory; Vino is second; Lance and I finish with five others, with Ullrich only 1:24 behind. Afterward, all the talk in the media is of Lance’s weakness. But we riders know that they’ve got it wrong. The truth is that the playing field, for the first time in my Tour de France career, is level."
*blood bags
oz. Legsondopestrong
vsi bodo končno ceno plačali s svojim zdravjem, bolj bi se jim izplačalo kadit in uživat življenje
govori nekaterih v tej temi, da so pogoji dirk neživljenski in da doping do nekatere mere mora bit, noro
vsak, ki je šel gonit na makarone na Franjo je videl, koliko je ura, potem se pa vsedi pred tv in navijaj za koga na touru
časi bi bili višji, človeško telo bi to zmoglo brez mamil, le počasneje
vsi bodo končno ceno plačali s svojim zdravjem, bolj bi se jim izplačalo kadit in uživat življenje
govori nekaterih v tej temi, da so pogoji dirk neživljenski in da doping do nekatere mere mora bit, noro
vsak, ki je šel gonit na makarone na Franjo je videl, koliko je ura, potem se pa vsedi pred tv in navijaj za koga na touru
časi bi bili višji, človeško telo bi to zmoglo brez mamil, le počasneje
Pričanja, pričanja in pričanja .. vse lažno ... Kje so papirji o zašitju armstronga z dopingom? Ni jih in nikoli jih ne bo ...
Stari, pa si ti prebral tisti 1000 stranski dokument, ki ga je USADA sproducirala? Ali pa vsaj 200 stranski povzetek? Tam noter je še marsikaj drugega kot samo izjave prič.
Ker če ga nisi, so tvoje izjave milo rečeno smešne.
Sicer pa upam, da Discovery čimprej posname eno oddajo o primeru, da se boš tudi ti lahko izobrazil.
Ker če ga nisi, so tvoje izjave milo rečeno smešne.
Sicer pa upam, da Discovery čimprej posname eno oddajo o primeru, da se boš tudi ti lahko izobrazil.
Sem prebral povzetek. Notri ni niti enega fizičnega dokaza (torej pozitivnega izvida dopinške kontrole). Samo rekla-kazala in podobno.
Če kaj spremljaš vzdržljivostne športe v zadnjih letih, potem najbrž veš, da je redko kdo padel zaradi neposrednega dokaza. Večino so dobili na podlagi pričanj, izmikanja testiranju, ali zaradi drugih snovi, ki so jih našli, ki nakazujejo , da je nekdo užival prepovedane substance, v zadnjem času pa s t.i. Biološkim potnim listom, ki je v bistvu čista statistična metoda, saj na podlagi razlik v parametrih iščejo potencialne doperje. Samo spomni se, kaka afera je bila lani, ko so Contadorja zašili, ko je celo španska nacinalna zveza najprej protestirala. Ampak tip je točno vedel, da ga imajo pravico na tak način testirat.
Naslednja stvar so recimo podatki o moči, ki so jih ekipe svoje cajte redno objavljale. Tam so recimo LA in company dosegali take vanzemaljske rezultate, ki fiziološko niso možni. Npr. na ta večjih klancih na Touru. Od leta 2010 (ali 2009), ko so uvedli prej omenjeni pasoš, so rezultati padli za kar nekaj procentov. Ali ni to čudno. Oprema je vedno boljša, načini treninga in priprav so vedno boljši, rezultati pa v povprečju slabši. Ampak ne, vi verniki boste rekli, da če te ne dobijo z zapičeno iglo v roki, da nisi kriv.
To so predvsem PR spini za vernike, vsem športnikom je točno jasno, da ko se pojavi posreden dokaz, ode sezona ali dve, na njih pa je, ali bodo to reskirali ali ne. Vse te pritožbe in čakanje na B vzorce in opravičevanje, kako so se mazali s kremo, ker jih je rit bolela, so za množice. To že kar nekaj let ne pali.
Ja strinjam se, da je lahko to nepravično, ampak jebiga, pol pa nehaj tekmovat.
Pa še to. LA je bil tak frajer, da je na svoji strani redno objavljal svoje vrednosti hematokrita in ostalih parametrov v krvi, še posebej, ko se je po premoru vrnil nazaj na Tour in takrat so bile govorice okrog vsega skupaj že zelo močne. No frajerji so tudi te njegove podatke šli testirat z biološkim pasošom. In rezultat? Pogrnu je na celi črti. Ampak ne, nobenega dokaza. PR spin za vernike pravim jaz.
Naslednja stvar so recimo podatki o moči, ki so jih ekipe svoje cajte redno objavljale. Tam so recimo LA in company dosegali take vanzemaljske rezultate, ki fiziološko niso možni. Npr. na ta večjih klancih na Touru. Od leta 2010 (ali 2009), ko so uvedli prej omenjeni pasoš, so rezultati padli za kar nekaj procentov. Ali ni to čudno. Oprema je vedno boljša, načini treninga in priprav so vedno boljši, rezultati pa v povprečju slabši. Ampak ne, vi verniki boste rekli, da če te ne dobijo z zapičeno iglo v roki, da nisi kriv.
To so predvsem PR spini za vernike, vsem športnikom je točno jasno, da ko se pojavi posreden dokaz, ode sezona ali dve, na njih pa je, ali bodo to reskirali ali ne. Vse te pritožbe in čakanje na B vzorce in opravičevanje, kako so se mazali s kremo, ker jih je rit bolela, so za množice. To že kar nekaj let ne pali.
Ja strinjam se, da je lahko to nepravično, ampak jebiga, pol pa nehaj tekmovat.
Pa še to. LA je bil tak frajer, da je na svoji strani redno objavljal svoje vrednosti hematokrita in ostalih parametrov v krvi, še posebej, ko se je po premoru vrnil nazaj na Tour in takrat so bile govorice okrog vsega skupaj že zelo močne. No frajerji so tudi te njegove podatke šli testirat z biološkim pasošom. In rezultat? Pogrnu je na celi črti. Ampak ne, nobenega dokaza. PR spin za vernike pravim jaz.
Nisem noben vernik, samo na k... mi grejo razna linčanja. Ne le armstronga, takih priemrov, da ljudje niso poadli na testu, pa so jih fasali, je cel kup.
Na testu ga niso dobili, izmaknil se tudi ni (drugače bi bil kaznovan - to, da se nekdo izmakne testu, je zame enako, kt da je bil pozitiven).
Biološki pasoš? Posredni dokazi. Sama statistika.
Na testu ga niso dobili, izmaknil se tudi ni (drugače bi bil kaznovan - to, da se nekdo izmakne testu, je zame enako, kt da je bil pozitiven).
Biološki pasoš? Posredni dokazi. Sama statistika.
S tem se težko strinjam, določeni časi res tako kažejo.
Contador je v letu 2009 dosegel mislim da najboljše razmerje W/kg .
Tukaj imaš podatke: http://www.sportsscientists.com/2009/07/tour-2009-contador-climb.html
Btw, froom naj bi na letošnjem touru še izboljšal contadorjev rezultat
Ja, vendar jaz nisem govoril o enkratnem absolutnem rekordu, ampak o povprečju. Tudi sam uporabljam navedeno stran kot eno od pomembnih referenc. Nižje v članku ti tudi piše kakšna vprašanja to sproža, seveda je pa vse brez točnih dokazov. Gre zgolj zato, da ko nekdo naredi nekaj izjemnega, kar ni do takrat uspelo še nikomur, poleg občudovanj seveda sproži tudi vprašanja, na kak način je to dosegel, še pobej, ko gre za mejnike, ki so na meji človeških zmogljivosti.
Žal se je do sedaj v večini primerov, vsaj v kolesarjenju, izkazalo, da so športniki, ki so jih dosegli, vprašljivi, ker so jih nekje dobili.
Sicer pa je zanimiva tudi lestvica ostalih dosežkov.
Žal se je do sedaj v večini primerov, vsaj v kolesarjenju, izkazalo, da so športniki, ki so jih dosegli, vprašljivi, ker so jih nekje dobili.
Sicer pa je zanimiva tudi lestvica ostalih dosežkov.
